Joss commentary from the S7 DVD on Spuffy

STARTED APR 3, 2004 · 50 POSTSSome posts in this thread didn't survive.

MythTHREAD STARTER6 posts in this thread

#1 · Apr 3, 2004

I posted this over on Spuffy, but Aeryn and JK told him to hustle my butt here with this. It's pretty much a transcript of JW's thoughts/comments regarding Spuffy in S6.

[quote]You're very very very VERY wrong (thankfully) he talks a lot about
Bufy and Spike through the whole commentary how James and Sarah
bring a history and intimacy and vulnaribilty to their scenes that
take it to a different level from that that David and Sarah work
on.. how they have rebuilt trust and comfort and intimacy but it's
not sexual (I'll transcribe it all tomorrow) although he says the
fade to black encourages to believe what we wish and if we wish to
believe they spent their last night making love or talking thats
fine ,that shot of them in the basement was about trust and
connection and it's the most imporatnt in the show . And he talks
about Spike as " our boy" how " our boy is redeemed and saved and
destroyed and completed by the Soul and how fantastic James is .
what supurb acting chops he has and how he loves him (and not just
for his shiny shiny hair) he talks a lot about how Sarah and James
seemed to have got together and arrived at the wrong reading of the
end, they were playing it as things falling apart but he told them
no . the sound and the world and the battle fade away it's just
them. perfect intimacy and the romance of the flaming hands the
culmination of a complex rich relationship ..he seemed very
surprised that James and Sarah had it so wrong because James is
usually on the nail and that Sarah never really did seem to
understand exactly what he was after but he got it anyway ... and
yes " Love him when you say you Love him.. Love her when you say she
doesn't" .. The only mention of CGI was that they used a real burn
but the gel showed so they GCI'd it

And for what it's worth the Cookie dough was Marti's pitch

MORE -

Aeryn10 posts in this thread

#2 · Apr 3, 2004

Very Happy

I *knew* I wasn't imagining that and my constant references to Han and Leia weren't in vain...... which reminds me I have a Han and Leia icon.

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Dawnie2 posts in this thread

#3 · Apr 3, 2004

Hmm....I am sure VL and jojo will be here to protest...so for now just -

Aeryn10 posts in this thread

#4 · Apr 3, 2004

I can't comment right now, but I think what I want to say is.......

It sounds like something a woman does. I have done it. Myth has done it. The cookie dought speech. Men don't do that. But us women have to throw a guy a bone sorta thing. Men just say, it isn't you, it's me. This is the female version of it isn't you.

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Myth6 posts in this thread

#5 · Apr 3, 2004

I may have done the cookie speech thingy...I also used...I have to wash my hair 24/7 and I won't have time for anything until my hair is just right Very Happy

Dawnie - This is off the S6 DVD. There's more but I can't find it right now. It does a Spuffy gooooooooooooooooooooooood Very Happy

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JK136 posts in this thread

#6 · Apr 3, 2004

JK136 posts in this thread

#7 · Apr 3, 2004

Myth...

This is sooo good for the spuffy soul! After Joss playin with our minds and never having Buffy fully admit her feelings VERBALLY (though she showed us over and over with her actions). This is a long - coll drink of water to a thirst soul! Spuffy sweetness from the words of the creator! Razz Gotsta say I'm havin sweet dreams tonight!

Spuffy Forever!!!

Dawnie2 posts in this thread

#8 · Apr 3, 2004

Aeryn10 posts in this thread

#9 · Apr 3, 2004

Not all about the actors. It explains to us that what we saw wasn't figments of imagination...... but it was real and passion..... and I so glad to finally see something like this. We all knew she did love him, that is why she chose him for her champion. She chose Spike and he died knowing that.

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Xbox4 posts in this thread

#10 · Apr 3, 2004

I foresee much blood will be shed in a shipping war to come as dawn approaches upon these here waters...

*hides*

But this at least inspires me to buy the season six dvd.

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JK136 posts in this thread

#11 · Apr 3, 2004

Some about the actors and I agree, Sarah and James are superb actors and both work the chemistry together like magic! But he also says about them missing the ending about the connection. I love that...the trust and connection being more important than the sex! Hello...that is what real relationships are ALL about! Trust and connection...deep connection like they had. Finally after never throwing us a bone on the TV screen and having Buffy openly admit her feelings about Spike (though she did show it in her actions)...at least Joss tells us what he intended! That they had a history and a deeper connection. Man, I must reread that commentary over and over again. I can't wait to hear Joss say it on the DVD set! OMG! Finally!!!

Spuffy Forever!!!

sprook2 posts in this thread

#12 · Apr 4, 2004

*shakes head at the war to come...sits down on the sofa with a bucket of popcorn and soda*

Here JoJo, Steph....rollin'

This stuff is so old...*shakes head*

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JediOz3 posts in this thread

#13 · Apr 4, 2004

*gets the tranquiler gun ready*

Steph, Jojo, it's going to be okay.

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#14 · Apr 4, 2004

To be honest, I'm having trouble understanding what Joss is saying exactly. Confused

Maybe somebody could clarify? He's saying that Buffy was IN love with Spike? Is that how you're interpreting this?

If that's indeed the case and Joss is stating that Buffy really meant she was IN love with Spike, then I can accept that. I've always said this. It doesn't change the fact that I'll always think Angel's the one.

Buffy's allowed to love other people, even though I don't believe Joss played the scene right if it's what he wanted to portray.

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Fogey3 posts in this thread

#15 · Apr 4, 2004

I think Joss said that even James & SMG could not see what the Spuffy shippers & Joss felt the relationship was. Twisted Evil Their thoughts were more in line with Jo Jo's about the relationship between Buffy & Spike despite their chemistry as actors. Poor Joss experienced a failure to communicate his intent. Rolling Eyes

Twisted Evil Wink Laughing Laughing Laughing

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Aeryn10 posts in this thread

#16 · Apr 4, 2004

*Sits down with Sprook and grabs some popcorn*

Incoming xbox!

*Chugs some more of her vodka*

Don't worry I had to get my answers.. my clarification as well, but I think that is understandable.

Just think of it like this..... it helped me. Han and Leia.

*adjusts self in seat*

Sprook you need a bigger comfie chair. Sad

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Fogey3 posts in this thread

#17 · Apr 4, 2004

sprook2 posts in this thread

#18 · Apr 4, 2004

jojo9 posts in this thread

#19 · Apr 4, 2004

Well, can't say much about the Spuffy stuff cuz I can't change what Joss said or did not say, but this was also in the commentary:

Aeryn10 posts in this thread

#20 · Apr 4, 2004

Bless you sprook.

Jojo u did an edit from last time I was here. Now I you confuzzled me with the last sentence, but I think Fogey clarified.

*Gets in the comfier chair*

Joss is saying that Buffy did love Spike and that Spike died knowing she did and loved her as well. That was his intent. It was also his intent to do the fade out so the viewers could use their imaginations, so to speak. Whatever you wanted insert into the fadeout.

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jojo9 posts in this thread

#21 · Apr 4, 2004

I just think he did a shitty job if that's what he was trying to portray at the end. Sorry.

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Aeryn10 posts in this thread

#22 · Apr 4, 2004

jojo9 posts in this thread

#23 · Apr 4, 2004

I get that it's perspective, and I could even buy Spike saying that to get her out of there....sort of. But the fact that Buffy didn't try to convince him before he died is what gets me every time. I just can't get over that.

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Aeryn10 posts in this thread

#24 · Apr 4, 2004

There was time?

Plus, the trust and connection they had....... actions speak louder than words. She knew that he knew and he knew that she knew. They were connected beyond the physical. Their whole thing in S7 was based on the rebuilding of the trust, true intimacy and comfort.

Her leaving when she did was to ensure that his love and his scarifice *did not* go to waste. That she would live on for him. OMWF "So that one of us is living... we have to go on living..." Or something, I can't get my lines right. She knew that it was that important to him that she live. The end of Chosen was foreshadowed in that scene of him coming to her in the Bronze in OMWF and stopping her from burning up as he does in Chosen.

I should go to bed. I am beat and will soon start to slur typing if I am not doing that now.

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jojo9 posts in this thread

#25 · Apr 4, 2004

Night, Aeryn.

Still don't think the scene made sense, though...Laughing

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#26 · Apr 4, 2004

JoJo, I love ya darlin.

** JK holds out a handful of flowers and a get well card**
I hope you feel better tomorrow and I'm glad there hasn't been gernades. Shocked

Fogey...are you saying that the spuffy croud is in sync with Joss? Whoa! Imagine that! Shocked Does that mean we are crazy demented bastards like him? (don't answer that!)

Spuffy Forever!!!

jojo9 posts in this thread

#27 · Apr 4, 2004

Aww, thanks JK. Love ya, too. Wink

Shocked Another shipper discussion that didn't end in a blood bath.

Now I'm getting scared.

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JediOz3 posts in this thread

#28 · Apr 4, 2004

Vampire Lady2 posts in this thread

#29 · Apr 4, 2004

I've only really skimmed through this thread because somebody who shall remain annonymous has warned me that it will ruin my day...

However, I did read some comments, mainly the ones about shipper wars and Jojo and I getting amunition and such, and all I have to say is Laughing

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#30 · Apr 4, 2004

jojo9 posts in this thread

#31 · Apr 4, 2004

JK - Thanks again! Smile

Steph - If you need help rationalizing it...gimme a shout! Wink Laughing

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Vampire Lady2 posts in this thread

#32 · Apr 4, 2004

Jojo - to rationalize, I would have to actually thouroughly read. I don't want to do that... I want to keep the topics that I'm reading less thought heavy right now. Laughing

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#33 · Apr 4, 2004

jojo9 posts in this thread

#34 · Apr 4, 2004

Steph - Don't sweat it, girl. Doesn't change the future, IMO. And that's the most important thing.

Anyways, when you do read it...lemme know. Laughing

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#35 · Apr 4, 2004

Laughing

You never stop cracking me up Jo. You are one loyal B/Aer! Wink

JW:

Zoriah1 post in this thread

#36 · Apr 4, 2004

I loved reading the entire transcript, it was awesome!

Um just a small nitpick though. I'm pretty sure it's the commentary for Chosen in season 7 not 6 (thread title).

fat_tony2 posts in this thread

#37 · Apr 4, 2004

Uh, JK...That stuff he said about them having to put the Angel bit in, I do believe that was a joke...you know, seeing that it was a direct continuation (that's not a word, is it?) to his "Parker is her real love" joke thingy... Rolling Eyes

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#38 · Apr 4, 2004

I think this is just a way for Joss to throw everyone off before he unveils to the world that he truly wanted Buffy with Luke Perry all along.

Puffy shippers rule! Whooo!

*sits back down*

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Myth6 posts in this thread

#39 · Apr 4, 2004

Xbox - If Luke Perry made the scene...I don't think I would complain. I liked Pike.

When it comes to the 'Buffy ships' on BTVS, I think Joss is well aware of all the thoughts and comments on the boards regarding them. Spuffies saw what Joss wanted to convey between B &S and the B/Aers interpreted it differently stating that it was confusing and slanted things in a B/A way. It's okay because if you are a shipper, it's a 'thing' you do. Due to of all the shipping squabbles/wars, Joss wanted to make his views known. I am happy. It gives definitive validation to what I SAWand FELT about Spuffy and I am sure that other Spuffies feel the same.

Jo - hope you are feeling better.

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Xbox4 posts in this thread

#40 · Apr 4, 2004

Myth6 posts in this thread

#41 · Apr 4, 2004

Xbox - actually I have this thing for Luke Perry Cool So of course I would like Pike Very Happy The Buffy movie may be considered bad by so many but I liked it...it did have some good points. Wink

Zoriah - I corrected...thank you.

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Xbox4 posts in this thread

#42 · Apr 4, 2004

Well, honestly, I was more impressed with Ben Affleck in the film. Just felt they should have given him more of a part...maybe even some lines or a plot and character name. Regardless, Dylan as a vampire is still good enough reason for me to rank this as an instant classic. Luke Perry deserves a belated oscar nomination damn it!

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Fogey3 posts in this thread

#43 · Apr 4, 2004

Bad Fogey[image], Bad Fogey[image]. Spuffy baiting is such fun, I mixed it in with the serious parts of my reply. So in modification of my stance, here is what I think happened. SMG and James were going to treat the scene as holding hands while sinking into despair over the catastrophe. Joss however wanted it to be a revitalization of Buffy through the loving support of a friend. I dont think this was about support through sexual/romantic love but rather support of the type we saw with Willow and Xander when he said he loved her and helped drag her back from the brink when she was ready to give up the fight and life. We also saw a similar mutual support scene in season 6 of BTVS when Buffy & Xander were together on the bench, just before Tara was shot. Crying or Very sad

So I do not believe this was either a romantic love scene or a despair ridden scene. Rather I view, what Joss was intending, as being a scene showing mutual support and gaining strength through the support of those who love you (brotherly love might be the appropriate term? or family love?)

I believe that once the sex died down, Buffy came to see Spike in much the same way she sees Xander, a friend she loves and finds support in. I think Joss intended to show that support and strengthening influence on Buffy in this scene.

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fat_tony2 posts in this thread

#44 · Apr 4, 2004

Fogey - Hear, hear!

Myth6 posts in this thread

#45 · Apr 4, 2004

Fogey - there is another segment of JW's comments that I couldn't find. Zoriah did and I have asked her to post it here and she hopefully will once she gets my pm. It leaves no doubt. Buffy LOVED Spike...BTVS ended that way. I cringe at the thought of Buffy feeling toward Spike like she did toward Xander. I am in the camp that feels that Xander was like a brother to Buffy...kin to the end. And that is a beautiful thing too!!

One of the other comments deals with Joss saying that Buffy and Angel said goodbye in A GRAVEYARD...this was done on purpose. Wonder why?

I think we all knew that we would have to wait for the dvd commentary on a lot of things....when it comes out of JW's mouth...it should be cannon.

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Aeryn10 posts in this thread

#46 · Apr 4, 2004

Myth6 posts in this thread

#47 · Apr 4, 2004

Aeryn - I am just pleased with JW's comments. I think he knew that these comments would be known and out all over the internet before the end of ATS this season. I don't know how to figure it for the ship ending...really.

I think the only way for Joss to end it is too have all 3 agree that since she is human and now has the opportunity to live a more normal life...that she should. It would show that both vamps loved her and due to this love they want her to have a life. This is logical and Buffy has to agree with it. Can't have kids and fat and sassy grandkids with a vamp. I just want Spike to hear something solid from Buffy about the 'love'.

This can leave doors open for a spinoff. There are so many rumors about the season finale...the one that gets to me is that Joss will kill off everybody. Of course, death is never seems to be tyoo permanent in Jossverse.

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Aeryn10 posts in this thread

#48 · Apr 4, 2004

Dang, he already killed off my Fred and Spike already, better not touch Fred.

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Aeryn10 posts in this thread

#49 · Apr 4, 2004

jojo9 posts in this thread

#50 · Apr 4, 2004

Here's the entire transcript from the commentary:

http://www.smgboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=14191

Myth - Actually, I've been hearing that some Spuffy shippers are upset by Whedon's comments, because in a way he's saying that Spike was the man of the moment in Buffy's life. So some find that annoying I guess.

I still don't know how exactly to view that scene. To me, it's either she was in love with him in that one moment (which is why she didn't stay to convince him because it still wasn't what Spike wanted) or it wasn't in that way at all. The important thing is that Spike was there for Buffy at a very difficult time in her life in season 7. And while I don't agree with the way they organized the season's storylines, that's what they showed. I dunno...once again, Joss fails to decide on the issue. Ugh.

And I see his comments about B/A very telling. He's saying that it was meant to give fans hope that they might still have a future together. That's all I need to know. As for the graveyard scene, I think he just wanted to show Angel leaving Sunnydale the very same way he left in 'WTTHM', where he walked backwards into the shadows. That shows even more that it's not over between them.

He was obviously being sarcastic when he stated that the B/A group is a "minority", which is why he talks about Parker being the love of her life right after. So I dunno how you can interpret what he said as the scene throwing a bone to those shippers. I think someone really wants to twist his words. Wink

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