The OFFICIAL DOLLHOUSE Thread!

Don completely agree with you Alpha the more interesting storyline.
Seems like the missions ie engagements are the least engaging frills of the episode. I like the internal larger arcs. Always have with Joss.

Not sure I am totally sold but at least I can see them online when I want.

I was gone this weekend so I DVR'd the second episode and watched it today. I have to say that I am aggravated and disappointed thus far......
-The only character I like a wee bit is Samuelson and yet I can't help but wonder why he would become a handler when he shows so much contempt for the Dollhouse org unless he has an ulterior motive.
-The Dollhouse takes money from clients to do anything.....including sleeping with the client. Hello!!!! Thus far Echo is mostly a 'high priced' call girl who doesn't even get any of the money.
-Unless the Dollhouse agents were forced into the mind sweep (continuous mind rape), there is nothing engaging about these agents that are nothing but innocent children or better still, empty shells before programing. If the agents consented to being programmed, then they were empty shells even before the programing.
-The actor who looks like Tom Lenz gives me the creeps. Andrew on BTVS was funny in his nerd way even when he was bad but at least he worked his way back to the good side.
-There is no signature JW humor to be found here....at all.
-The British broad is totally annoying and her 'second' is even more annoying.
-Amy Acker just walks through scenes. And hello...she is a doctor with the WORST plastic surgery EVER!!! This is a wealthy org. that can't afford plastic surgery???

I like the idea of Alpha and at this point I am kind of hoping he slices and dices the rest of the cast. I am hoping that JW plans to have Echo remember and work to destroy the Dollhouse because her weekly jobs will get old fast as well as her bouncy innocent little girl act. I liked Faith. She was a bad ass anti-hero with issues who eventually found her redemptive path. Damn I am missing the heart, the quips....the intelligence of BTVS and FIREFLY.

I do like the name ECHO. Very good name and appropriate.

It appears that JW is a fan of BSG...he now has two actors from that cast.

Uhhh... What Myth said....

You nailed it lady.

The Dollhouse takes money from clients to do anything.....including sleeping with the client. Hello!!!! Thus far Echo is mostly a 'high priced' call girl who doesn't even get any of the money.

Umm with a title like Dollhouse we should expect a "Walk on the Wild Side" event or two even if it is not set in 1930's New Orleans.

-Unless the Dollhouse agents were forced into the mind sweep (continuous mind rape), there is nothing engaging about these agents that are nothing but innocent children or better still, empty shells before programing. If the agents consented to being programmed, then they were empty shells even before the programing.

Haven't played the tape of the second episode yet but I would wonder if they were given the whole story/true story of what their treatments would consist of when they signed up. Guess I will watch ep 2 as soon as possible,

Yeah Fogey I see your point but Joss is the big women empowerment dude. Does he always have to use the cliche of call girl-esque freedom and redemption fighters.

I have to agree it gets tiresome that the Dollhouse can be for a time distilled into a high price call girl outfit. Westworld did a better job at providing those right. ;) Plus a cool cowboy shoot out. and other mad crazy robots. Are we not going to have the mad crazy eraser brain robots turn into killing machines? Oh wait they have done that in the first episode with Alpha.

I have to say I expect more.

Yeah Ramones/Myth I don't care for the way they are sometimes rented out as sex toys. At least Echo is showing signs of retaining some memories and not being wiped totally clean each time she returns. I believe that will lead to an empowerment theme.

Does anyone see any significance to the use of the phonetic alphabet for doll names?
NATO Phonetic Alphabet
Letter phonetic letter
A Alpha
B Bravo
C Charlie
D Delta
E Echo
F Foxtrot
G Golf
H Hotel
I India
J Juliet
K Kilo
L Lima
M Mike
N November
O Oscar
P Papa
Q Quebec
R Romeo
S Sierra
T Tango
U Uniform
V Victor
W Whiskey
X X-ray
Y Yankee
Z Zulu

Thanks for the update - edited to add Victor

You forgot Victor - he was just revealed in Ep 3.

I'm liking where this is all going. It has gotten remarkably better than the pilot. It's almost starting to feel like it has the Joss touch to it and will hopefully fully feel that way in another episode or two.

I'm still not enjoying this series but I will continue to watch just to see if JW FINALLY does something with it! I am extremely pissed with all the unnecessary 'T&A'....and I don't usually bitch about this stuff at all. It's like watching a Pam Anderson series. Why the need for this? Granted, ED is a fine looking woman and I have always liked her but can the clothes get any tighter?...or fewer? I don't know, I just expect more from JW's talents rather than out and out "sex on stilletoes or biker boots'. Maybe I'm aggravated because it seems that JW and/or ED are afraid to rely on ED's acting chops or storyline and throw in mucho eye candy. Grrrrr. Come on....you know what I mean. It's not like the clothes or lack thereof or the 'poses' are worked well into the episode...they are overdone. BTVS, ATS and FIREFLY didn't resort to this....except maybe that first season of BTVS that I affectionately refer to as the season of the 'push-up bra'. I am curious now why the first episode had to be re-vamped. I JUST had to say re-vamped ;)

As far as I am concerned, we have an evil "Watchers Council' overseeing the Dollhouse which is another Wolfram and Hart real time. The Dollhouse is 'evil' and as pissed as I am about the 'high priced call girl' aspect, I am horrified that the 'agents/dolls/whatever are totally expendable for a high enough price. The Dollhouse NEEDS to go down. I think this is the direction of the show....I hope. It feels a little like ALIAS and La FEMME NIKITA but not half as good thus far.

Here's another problem: The ratings dipped for the second episode and again for the third. General viewers weren't impressed and didn't go back for a second look. This leaves the 'action' viewers' and JW fans...and this isn't enough to keep this series alive on FOX where dim wit execs thrive. I am willing to keep watching because I know that down the line JW will deliver (Hopefully), but the general viewer has already given up and headed over to a reality show rather then give a new show a chance to develop. I wish that this series had premiered during the summer when viewers are dying for something new.

Fogey - it looks like THE SARAH CONNOR CHRONICLES is losing the ratings battle and did not prove to be a good lead in for the DOLLHOUSE. Did you notice that Joss introduced a "tara' type character into the cast?

Here's hoping that they introduce Tango in the next episode 8-)

Grrr Argh.

Here's hoping that they introduce Tango in the next episode

Here's hoping that they introduce Foxtrot in the next episode. ;)

Darn I was hoping both Sarah chronicles and Echo dolly would have decent ratings :cry:
Didn't notice Tara character yet - still catching up on shows I missed/recorded during Mardi Gras 8-)

The 4th episode was so much better. I wish they had chosen this ep for the premiere and then back tracked! I didn't mind the Tom Lentz doppleganger (?) so much this time around. I look forward to the CASTLE premiere tonight....it looks like fun.

I caught up with BREAKING BAD ON DEMAND and iwas like :shock: :o :shock: :o . I am mesmerized considering the subject matter.

So Myth takes us out of the Dollhouse and puts us in the Castle. :mrgreen:

Tried Castle and it was fun but it also may need work to make it stand out. In varous places it reminded me of The Mentalist, Law & Order Criminal intent and even gasp Murder She Wrote.

Some asswipe at another site I post at revealed who is playing Alpha. If you want to know, shoot me a PM. I didn't want to know.

That sucks Don. I so do not want that information. People need to learn to not be stupid. But then again, if they knew how to learn then they shouldn't be stupid.


This weeks ep was so OMJ! it wasn't even funny! Anybody else expecting that? 'Cause I know I wasn't!

Yeah, this week's episode was really good. I think Joss and Company may have realized that the mysteries behind the Dollhouse are infinitely more interesting than seeing Echo act as Tom Cruise's midwife.

This weeks ep was so OMJ! it wasn't even funny! Anybody else expecting that? 'Cause I know I wasn't!

Umm yup! The neighbor being from the dollhouse I expected even though I suspected employee not doll. However Echo's speech caught me totally off guard! :shock:

Is Alpha connected to those who spoke through Echo? Or is he a loaner?

Anyhows the lady helping the doll programmer was a double agent on NCIS so maybe she is the one slipping the rogue programming in? Er guess I shouldn't transfer characteristics from one show to another, but she is in a good position to murk up the programming on the sly.

FOGEY WROTE:
Anyhows the lady helping the doll programmer was a double agent on NCIS so maybe she is the one slipping the rogue programming in? Er guess I shouldn't transfer characteristics from one show to another, but she is in a good position to murk up the programming on the sly.

I had that thought too. Especially since it seems like the programmer only uses her to do errands and get him lunch.

So, I'm going to throw this out there. Anybody else think that Paul (Helo from BSG) is a doll from another house? I'm beginning to suspect it with the dream from tonight's eppy. With it being Whedon, though, it could be a ruse, too.

So......they let the dolls wake up and get back some of their memories for the sake of closure so they can 'reset' them???? Does this mean that the dolls will be pimped out again??? Anyone else think JW has a thing for mind rape and pimping??????

I try not to comment in here because my comments are going to be too negative on this series. I watch because Friday nights totally lack right now (and usually do) with any decent shows especially now that BSG has ended but I think JW has lost his touch....or his mind. I keep sitting back and hoping.....and hoping.

Sorry guys and gals but I lost my enthusiasm and I so wish that this wasn't the case. I am glad to see others here are enjoying the show.

Sorry, Myth. I have to respectfully disagree. I'm loving Dollhouse. I agree that the Dollhouse is wrong in the mind rape and pimping, but hello? evil. I don't mind what Joss has done to set up that this is an operation that needs to be shut down. If they weren't doing some pretty down right despicable stuff, why would we be rooting for Paul Ballard to find Caroline? Why would we really want Echo to break free and help bring it down from the inside? I'm a fan...until Fox kills it, of course.

I was very disappointed with the pilot, but by ep. 3 was hooked. Each episode has gotten remarkably better than the previous and I hope that keeps happening.

I completely understand the whole 'closure' thing from this past episode and it was kind of cool to see them be them without their memories. Makes me very curious who Victor really is 'cause his thing was just all about the girl. And obviously I want to know more about Caroline.

I have fallen in love with the show. The only thing that disappoints me is I can never remember some of the characters names, like the ones that run the dollhouse and the clean-up crew. Can never remember their names. I can't remember Topher's and Boyd's names half the time.

The number 2 henchman guy is Mr. Dominic. Amy Acker is Dr. Saunders, I believe. I can't remember evil British chick's name. We'll get the hang of the names...if Fox gives us a chance to.

Dollhouse has become my number one viewing priorty on my DVR. There are times I even make sure to watch it live. I just don't do that anymore with this one exception.

Val - Like I said, I am glad others are liking/loving this series. I just find myself totally disappointed so far.

Maybe we can start a discussion on the following based on the last episode:

Is the DOLLHOUSE evil because of how it uses its Dolls? Questionable, in a way, since we are led to believe that the Doll group chosen for 'reset' all suffered from some tragedy that had them going to the Dollhouse to have their memories wiped. Maybe I missed something along the way where the potential Dolls agreed or didn't care if they were given new identities to be used over and over again in various situations. If the Potentials didn't agree to this, then the Dollhouse is evil with the usage especially if said usage puts innocent people in deadly situations and this includes the Dolls. Opinions?

The last ep focused on Echo, Victor, Sierra and Mellie. It is obvious that all of them suffered from some traumatic event and yet it appears that Sierra was 'sold or kidnapped' into the program by her ex-lover/boyfriend/lewd guy who didn't get what he wanted. I had a problem with this explanation because watching the guy when Sierra confronted him...he didn't look or act like a guy who was happy about 'getting even with her or making her suffer'? Yes? No? There's more to Sierra's story or this was all trumped up by the Dollhouse peeps to give something of closure.

I think it is obvious that the Dolls were programmed to pass out once they had achieved their closure moments. I'm thinking that there are layers of programming here and thus far we are being lead to believe that the Dollhouse may be benevolent in their treatment of the Dolls at least where 'burying' their traumatic pasts are concerned. Is JW trying to make us feel better about the Dollhouse before slamming us with evilness?

Why is Boyd working for an organization that he obviously feels contempt for? Is the money that good or does he have a secret agenda or is he programmed too?

I am quite sure that I heard in one of the episodes that Alpha is a male because I was thinking that the tech could have been Alpha as well. Then again, Alpha is a known entity to the Dollhouse peeps, so I don't know if we have seen him as yet unless the FBI dude is Alpha. I think I will pm Don and spoil some stuff for myself so some things can can possibly make sense in my frazzled brain :(

If the FBI guy is taking a lot of flak from his fellow agents, then why is he allowed to work on this assignment/urban legend? I do think that he could be a Doll but then again, you don't become an FBI with credentials and background just by being programmed. Oh my brain........

I don't know, either we are dealing with corporate greed and the abuse of technology and people ....or DARK CITYish aspects.

Hope all of you can make sense of this jumble of thoughts and it would be nice if you put in your jumbled thoughts too.

I get the feeling that the Dollhouse is Wolfram and Hartesque. They just deal in the shady real world instead of dealing in the shady demon world. The sets are even similar.

We do know that the Dollhouse uses less than ethical tactics in their recruitment of Potentials. Caroline says in a flashback that she has little choice but to sign. And then there was the recent recruitment of the guy who poisoned the college campus. They used his mother as leverage to get him to agree. Do the Potentials know how they are to be used before they sign up? Given that they are more or less forced to sign, does it matter? Consent under duress is not true consent. And if Sierra's story was true, then the Dollhouse also deals with taking Potentials without even the appearance of consent. No matter what, the Dollhouse is using people for its own purposes and with a mentality that these people are possibly expendable. Treating human beings as disposable objects to be used and possibly discarded with little forethought. "Think of them as pets," the handlers are told in the last episode. If Joss is holding back on the Dollhouse's evilness, then how much more evil can they get?

I don't know what Boyd's story is? Could he be the mole on the inside? Could it be Dr. Saunders? Considering those are the two most likely suspects at the moment, I doubt it. It will be someone we don't suspect at all, knowing Joss.

Alpha is male. We've seen glimpses of him, but never seen his face. And he's been referred to as male in discussions about him.

I don't think Paul (the FBI agent) is a Doll. It seems pretty obvious that the Dollhouse considers him a threat, so he's not under their control. I don't think he's Alpha either. I can't point to any reasons why I think that, it's just an impression I've gotten while watching. I think he's assigned to the Dollhouse simply because he has ruffled too many feathers. What's the best way to punish an unruly agent, put him on a nowhere assignment about something that (you think) doesn't exist. Watch him chase his own tail for awhile.

Does any of this help, Myth? Or do you just have even more questions?

Is the DOLLHOUSE evil because of how it uses its Dolls?

Well that is one of the reasons that it is "evil". Lets see as Val pointed out the contracts, if they even exist, appear to have been signed under duress rendering them void. We have seen "Dolls" used for illegal purposes so that is another reason the contracts would be void. The "Dolls" at this point are either slaves or illegally indentured servants plus they are subjected to unethical medical experimentation - all signs of an evil "House" at work. We have seen house agents & Dolls murder, steal & spy on others. It will be interesting to see what the overall purpose of the association of Dollhouses is.

are being lead to believe that the Dollhouse may be benevolent in their treatment of the Dolls at least where 'burying' their traumatic pasts are concerned. Is JW trying to make us feel better about the Dollhouse before slamming us with evilness?

But wasn't burying their traumatic pasts done more in an effort to retain control over them and thus preserve them as valuable assets? Not exactly a benevolent goal of cleansing them of trauma; Cleansing of trauma is a goal that could have been accomplished without making them into "Dolls".

Boyd's motivations are a real puzzle to me.
FBI guy is not a Doll because they view him as a threat.

either we are dealing with corporate greed and the abuse of technology and people ....or DARK CITYish aspects.

Agreeed. :ugeek:

Val - Of course I have more questions. As you can tell, I am trying to get involved but I don't think my interest will be there until Alpha appears. Right now I think Alpha needs to turn the tide on all these levels of programming because all we have seen thus far is that the Dolls are trapped no matter what. I was enthused after one ep of BTVs and I was enthused by the 3rd ep of FIREFLY. DOLLHOUSE isn't cutting it yet for me.

Right now my favorite shows are LIFE and BREAKING BAD

Aww crap....LIFE has been canceled. Guess I have to treasure tonight's episode :cry: Looks like a lot of shows are in danger of cancellation on NBC because of Jay Leno getting the 10 to 11pm slot everynight. If they cancel CHUCK....I'm heading to California and doing my 'mad' face.

http://tvbythenumbers.com/category/renewcancel-fox-shows

Dollhouse looks like it will get the axe.

Myth, I'll join you and I have several friends who probably will as well.

It looks like May 8th is the last airing for DH.

Alpha is definitely male. I accidentally read who's playing Alpha, and of course, I won't spoil. I will say it's an interesting choice and will definitely be a new type of character for this actor (at least from the roles I've seen him play before).

I just got an email from Amazon.com saying that pre-orders for the Dollhouse dvd have started. I'm not sure if there would be access to this type of information, but it seems like the number of people who have ordered it would be an excellent statistic to have at hand when Joss & co are fighting for a renewal.

If you had "12" in the betting pool of how many episodes of Dollhouse will Fox show before giving it the axe, you just might be a winner.

Last night's episode was much better....they stuffed a lot into this hour.

1. What I liked the best was Sierra's shoes. Gotta get me some of those!!
2. I wonder if ED, the producer, is an exhibitionist or is trying to give us a grin moment with her opening outfits every episode :lol:
3. I liked the Mellie and FBI Ballard exchange. Creepy cool and I like the idea that she is a 'sleeper' Doll.
4. Mellie told Ballard to look beyond the technology and the people to find the REAL purpose behind the DH. I would have to see the ep again but I got the distinct impression that the DH may be the government because they did mention government vs. the private company. In a way, this would make sense because the real purpose behind the DH may be to garner info on its client or to 'program' them in key situations. The clients are high profile or incredibly wealthy.
5. DeWitt is a cold evil bitch but I felt a wee bit sorry for her last night. She definitely wants her 'programmed' Victor and the life she can't.
6. I was surprised at the 'spy' revelation.
7. Next week should be good because that was definitely Alpha at the end of the preview.

Thoughts?

It looks to me like Whedon and Co. are trying to wrap up every ongoing storyline from this year. However, they only have three more episodes to do it. But Ballard is learning things left and right, so we should at least get a conclusion to his storyline.

Laurence Dominic being a mole explains why Reed Diamond was always listed as a guest star. And I wasn't really surprised it was him. I knew it wasn't Ivy because they were trying to get us to think it was Ivy.

But I don't think he was the one supplying Ballard with info. That'll either be Alpha or DeWitt.

Mistress Echo... I hope the Parents Television Council didn't see that badonkadonk.

But I don't think he was the one supplying Ballard with info. That'll either be Alpha or DeWitt.

Agreed. It was not the NSA contacting Ballard because given their resources they could easily contact him without resorting to the high risk of exposure that goes with passing messages through a Doll. That type of contact is more the style of a loner or small group with limited resources. I think the NSA was only trying to co-opt the Doll House technology and Doll supply. I suspect Alpha et al is more in line with a shut down motive.

Mistress Echo... I hope the Parents Television Council didn't see that badonkadonk.

But I did :D Not into that style of play but I appreciated the er ah play-suit. :shock:

Joss is in the habit of ending the season with an episode that can serve either as an ending or as a cliffhanging transition into the following year so if the series is not renewed :cry: we should at least have some sort of conclusion we can live with.

SciFiWire is predicting that Dollhouse won't be renewed. *sigh*

SciFiWire is predicting that Dollhouse won't be renewed. *sigh*

Aw Crud! :evil: So many scripted shows drop off while (fake)reality shows continue to pollute.

Maybe when Allure Magazine :oops: hits he stands people will see what they are missing and flock to the show?

God bless Alan Tudyk. I think his appearance is too late to save the show for renewal....but we'll see.

I can't even begin to describe how much I LOVED Alan Tudyk!!! Why was I surprised? It was such a Joss Whedon thing to do. Why was I left with my chin on the floor? I don't know. I should have known better. But I was still shocked. And I, for one, will be very sad to see Dollhouse go. Things were just starting to get good!

Well, this is good news: http://www.thrfeed.com/2009/05/dollhouse-second-season.html

Better news is that NBC is probably going to bring back Chuck. But that's just me.

Yeah, I only really loved the last few episodes of Dollhouse whereas I love ALL episodes of Chuck :lol: :lol:

DON WROTE:Better news is that NBC is probably going to bring back Chuck. But that's just me.

No, that's better news for me too.

Ok, I now just read that Dollhouse and Castle are being officially renewed; Dollhouse for another 13 episodes in the same Friday night slot.

Which is nuts since that timeslot is CRAP!

13 Episodes is better than none. I just hope the same thing doesn't happen to Dollhouse that happened to Tru Calling. 13 eps ordered, they started filming, it was cut back to 6 since that's all that got finished before just cancelling it. Eventually, many many months later they finally aired 5 of the final 6 eps. I was pissed.

13 is better than none, but I'm still not getting my hopes too high about how much we're really gonna get.

http://www.fox.com/programming/

Dollhouse is back at 9:00 on Friday nights with a lead in from 'Til Death. Not exactly the way that you create more viewers.

I really have to say that I am surprised about DH not being canceled. You all know by now that I think it is a mess but maybe Joss will improve it....and maybe Fox doesn't have anything else better to replace it :? HEY....I'm just being honest here. This isn't like FIREFLY to me....it took 3 episodes and I was hooked. I have no investment in the characters on DH at all :cry: Well, FBI guy is cute but I already knew that from BSG. It was a nice surprise to see Amy Ackerman doing the doll thing (her talents were wasted up until then IMHO)and I was thrilled about having Alan Tudyk as Alpha.

Thrilled about CHUCK though. And Squee....we get to see Chuck with all the special skills next season. That will be a hoot.

I am happy about CASTLE too. That was a good finale.

I am totally pissed with NBC for canceling LIFE. That was one fine series. Sorry if no one here watched it...it was an unusual cop show with the impressive Damien Lewis in the lead. Jay Leno being on 5 nights a week at 10p.m. really messed up the schedule.

Castle and Doll House renewals are good news. Castle will make it for sure but I am concerned re DH, it hasn't lived up to its(Joss) potential yet.

In case anyone is interested, the un-aired 13th episode is online at some mildly illegal sites.

DVD gets released next Tuesday.